Jim, ARRL has in terms of product reviews, etc taken the position with respect to Part 90 certified radios with scanning receivers that are sold to hams is that it is fine because the Part 90 certification for the radio covers the scanning receiver and there is of course no Part 97 equipment authorization requirement. What perhaps John had in mind when he sent this around is that the FCC's policy on marketing radios that may be useful and marketable to hams and apparently in this case land mobile eligibles (not rules, but policies only, and policies which are very vague and in my view completely unenforceable), is that marketing of ham radios should be limited to hams and to eligibles in other services for which the radios were certified by FCC. In other words, marketing those radios to the general public could be viewed by FCC as a no-no, but of course there is no point of sale control anywhere in the FCC rules for Amateur or Part 90 equipment, and it doesn't seem that there is much chance of an FCC enforcement action for the sale of this radio, even if they are touting it as a sort of FRS radio. Post-sale enforcement relative to purchasers has never happened. 73, Chris W3KD Christopher D. Imlay Booth, Freret, Imlay & Tepper. P.C. 14356 Cape May Road Silver Spring, Maryland 20904-6011 (301) 384-5525 telephone (301) 384-6384 facsimile W3KD@ARRL.ORG -----Original Message----- From: James F. Boehner MD <jboehner01@yahoo.com> To: 'arrl-odv' <arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> Sent: Wed, Apr 25, 2012 8:41 pm Subject: [arrl-odv:20734] VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public The Baofeng, Like the Wouxun, is FCC Part 90 certified. It comes preloaded with a number of frequencies. I do not remember if any of them fall in the amateur radio bands. They are widely sold at hamfests. I have two. At $45-60, they are great “throw away” radios. Programming software generally comes with the unit or can be downloaded. The programming cable is cheap, and the units are easily programmed. A popular internet site that has a very wide variety of the Chinese radios is: http://www.409shop.com/ '73 de JIM N2ZZ ARRL Vice Director Roanoke Division ARRL, the national association for Amateur Radio™ From: arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org [mailto:arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org] On Behalf Of Grant Hopper Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 12:18 PM To: JRS Cc: arrl-odv Subject: [arrl-odv:20729] Re: Houston, We May Have A Problem - VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public Good catch John! The ad copy really makes it look like these are ok for the consumer to use anywhere in the range. I suspect we will not be the only radio service that will experience problems. If the FCC does step in, hopefully they will take the time to track down the purchasers. 73, Grant, KB7WSD On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 7:31 AM, JRS <jrs@hamradio.us.com> wrote: See: http://www.meritline.com/mini-walkie-talkie---p-77512.aspx?hq_e=el&hq_m=2430... These radios are advertised in English and are claimed to be shipped from China. 73 ----------------------------------------------------- John Robert Stratton N5AUS West Gulf Division Vice Director West Gulf Division Legislative Action Chair Office telephone: 512-445-6262 Cell: 512-426-2028 PO Box 2232 Austin, Texas 78768-2232 ----------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org http://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv -- 73, Grant Hopper, KB7WSD Vice Director, Northwestern Division _______________________________________________ rrl-odv mailing list rrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org ttp://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv

Agreed on all counts, Jim. What surprises me is that FCC seems willing to allow dual-service radios to be marketed without software blocking users in one service from using the radio in another service. Yaesu did that a long time ago with an Amateur/Aviation HT that always seemed to me to be quite inappropriate. Of course, there are many, many cases of multiple radio service-capable equipment authorization not involving Amateur Radio; the FRS/GMRS radios that Dave was talking about; the Parts 90, 80, 74 radios covering land mobile, marine and broadcast auxiliary (though in that situation I think the Part 90 radios have software that precludes transmit on channels allocated to the other services, etc.). Part 90 precludes field programmable radios. That would be a good limitation to apply to any combination of Amateur band transmit and other service transmit radios. I think that is the means of differentiating the Wouxun Part 90 version radio from the Part 97 version radio. 73, Chris W3KD Christopher D. Imlay Booth, Freret, Imlay & Tepper. P.C. 14356 Cape May Road Silver Spring, Maryland 20904-6011 (301) 384-5525 telephone (301) 384-6384 facsimile W3KD@ARRL.ORG -----Original Message----- From: James F. Boehner MD <jboehner01@yahoo.com> To: 'Chris Imlay' <w3kd@aol.com>; arrl-odv <arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> Sent: Fri, Apr 27, 2012 3:19 pm Subject: VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public Chris, Thank you for the information below. I think we would all be happier if sales of FCC type-certificated radios could be restricted to licensees of the respective services, but we know that would never happen, especially in the current day environment. It is good to have low cost Part 90 radios, as we as amateurs can benefit from them, especially if we are licensees of a land mobile service as well. Marketing to the general public is certainly a different matter. Chances are the radios would be used with the originally programmed frequencies-most of which were within the FCC land mobile band.

From the FCC enforcement actions, it appears that they are mainly going after “sitting ducks”, such as the Pilot gas stations for selling easily modified CB units, unlicensed low power FM broadcasters, etc. I agree it is doubtful that the FCC would step in on an issue like this.

When we had a problem with a jammer who harassed a ham in my area not just on the air, but by dialing his home number on the repeater autopatch at all times of the day and night AND the FCC had field agents, they turned a deaf ear to our reports. It was only when he started to do the same nonsense on the Public Safety repeater that they sent agents out. We then assisted them in finding the culprit. Fortunately the ham that was being harassed was also a public safety officer. Of even greater concern is contained within the e-mail under my signature. Dual band radios that have not even undergone FCC certification are being ordered by individuals in the US. Thanks again! '73 de JIM N2ZZ ARRL Vice Director Roanoke Division ARRL, the national association for Amateur Radio™ Dear friend, Good day! Thank you for your interest in our shop. For BJ-UV55: this mobile radio has not certified with FCC yet. but we have sold it to Europe and your country U.S. . and our customers feel the radio is nice. Any questions, pls let me know. May you have a nice day! Best regard, Sara ------ Subject: BJ-UV55 radio certification To: vivielect@hotmail.com Is this radio Certified with the FCC for sales in the U.S.? Please advise the FCC ID number on the radio for me. Thank you. http://www.radiomart.biz/baojie-bjuv55-multiple-function-vhfuhf-dual-band-tr... From: arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org [mailto:arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org] On Behalf Of Chris Imlay Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2012 9:38 AM To: jboehner01@yahoo.com; arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org Subject: [arrl-odv:20736] Re: VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public Jim, ARRL has in terms of product reviews, etc taken the position with respect to Part 90 certified radios with scanning receivers that are sold to hams is that it is fine because the Part 90 certification for the radio covers the scanning receiver and there is of course no Part 97 equipment authorization requirement. What perhaps John had in mind when he sent this around is that the FCC's policy on marketing radios that may be useful and marketable to hams and apparently in this case land mobile eligibles (not rules, but policies only, and policies which are very vague and in my view completely unenforceable), is that marketing of ham radios should be limited to hams and to eligibles in other services for which the radios were certified by FCC. In other words, marketing those radios to the general public could be viewed by FCC as a no-no, but of course there is no point of sale control anywhere in the FCC rules for Amateur or Part 90 equipment, and it doesn't seem that there is much chance of an FCC enforcement action for the sale of this radio, even if they are touting it as a sort of FRS radio. Post-sale enforcement relative to purchasers has never happened. 73, Chris W3KD Christopher D. Imlay Booth, Freret, Imlay & Tepper. P.C. 14356 Cape May Road Silver Spring, Maryland 20904-6011 (301) 384-5525 telephone (301) 384-6384 facsimile W3KD@ARRL.ORG -----Original Message----- From: James F. Boehner MD <jboehner01@yahoo.com> To: 'arrl-odv' <arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> Sent: Wed, Apr 25, 2012 8:41 pm Subject: [arrl-odv:20734] VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public The Baofeng, Like the Wouxun, is FCC Part 90 certified. It comes preloaded with a number of frequencies. I do not remember if any of them fall in the amateur radio bands. They are widely sold at hamfests. I have two. At $45-60, they are great “throw away” radios. Programming software generally comes with the unit or can be downloaded. The programming cable is cheap, and the units are easily programmed. A popular internet site that has a very wide variety of the Chinese radios is: http://www.409shop.com/ '73 de JIM N2ZZ ARRL Vice Director Roanoke Division ARRL, the national association for Amateur Radio™ From: arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org [mailto:arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org] On Behalf Of Grant Hopper Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2012 12:18 PM To: JRS Cc: arrl-odv Subject: [arrl-odv:20729] Re: Houston, We May Have A Problem - VHF/UHF Chinese Radios Being Sold To General Public Good catch John! The ad copy really makes it look like these are ok for the consumer to use anywhere in the range. I suspect we will not be the only radio service that will experience problems. If the FCC does step in, hopefully they will take the time to track down the purchasers. 73, Grant, KB7WSD On Wed, Apr 25, 2012 at 7:31 AM, JRS <jrs@hamradio.us.com> wrote: See: http://www.meritline.com/mini-walkie-talkie---p-77512.aspx?hq_e=el&hq_m=2430... These radios are advertised in English and are claimed to be shipped from China. 73 ----------------------------------------------------- John Robert Stratton N5AUS West Gulf Division Vice Director West Gulf Division Legislative Action Chair Office telephone: 512-445-6262 Cell: 512-426-2028 PO Box 2232 Austin, Texas 78768-2232 ----------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org http://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv -- 73, Grant Hopper, KB7WSD Vice Director, Northwestern Division _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org http://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv