[arrl-odv:29106] FW: Archive Error Report June 2012
To the Board: The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don't match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints. I don't intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38. I thought y'all would like to know. Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR Six Willarch Road Lincoln, MA 01773 781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org New England Director cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564 Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT From: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM To: hopengarten@post.harvard.edu Cc: Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012 Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us "touching" the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing. Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years. 73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager From: Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM To: Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012 Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine. Steve? Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR Six Willarch Road Lincoln, MA 01773 781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org New England Director cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564 Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT From: Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM To: Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY Subject: Archive Error Report June 2012 Hi Fred K1VR, I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine. The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section. This pagination is out of my expertise, I'll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version. Archive Error Report Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? Field Data on File Submitted Correction Id <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390> 140390 4556 Issue Jun 2012-QST Jun 2012-QST Title The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? Author Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR Column Feature Feature Keywords Page 30 30 File Other Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30. Notify Yes Email <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org> k1vr@arrl.org Corrected No Created 2019-12-15 16:05:53 Zak Lau W1VT Senior Lab Engineer ARRL, the National Association for Amateur RadioT 225 Main Street Newington, CT 06111 telephone: <tel:860%20594%200294> 860 594 0294 email: <mailto:zlau@arrl.org> zlau@arrl.org web: <http://www.arrl.org> www.arrl.org
But the page number at the bottom of the PDF is still correct. The digital version counts the cover as a page as well. Never had anyone bring this up to me. A quick glance at the bottom of the page tells you where you are. If this were to change, then the paper version would not match the PDF and that would be confusing. In my opinion... ? Mark,HDX [image: image.png] On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 9:38 AM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> wrote:
To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road*
*Lincoln, MA 01773*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM *To:* hopengarten@post.harvard.edu *Cc:* Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
*From:* Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM *To:* Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road*
*Lincoln, MA 01773*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org <w1vt@arrl.org>] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM *To:* Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY *Subject:* Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
*Archive Error Report*
*Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?*
*Field*
*Data on File*
*Submitted Correction*
Id
140390 <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390>
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-*QST*
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
*ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio*™
225 Main Street
Newington, CT 06111
telephone: 860 594 0294
email: zlau@arrl.org
web: www.arrl.org
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
Fred, et al., What you describe is how every digital subscription works from every provider I have ever tried. As Mark suggests, the digital version starts counting on the first page in the file. I frequently use RB Digital which is the interface in my county's electronic periodical subscriptions, and every magazine/journal works this way. I think no one has complained because everyone who uses digital subscriptions quickly learns that this is how it works. FWIW, many (if not all?) e-book reading situations work this way, too. 73, Greg, K0GW On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 12:22 PM Mark J Tharp <kb7hdx@gmail.com> wrote:
But the page number at the bottom of the PDF is still correct. The digital version counts the cover as a page as well. Never had anyone bring this up to me. A quick glance at the bottom of the page tells you where you are. If this were to change, then the paper version would not match the PDF and that would be confusing.
In my opinion... ?
Mark,HDX
[image: image.png]
On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 9:38 AM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> wrote:
To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road*
*Lincoln, MA 01773*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM *To:* hopengarten@post.harvard.edu *Cc:* Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
*From:* Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM *To:* Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road*
*Lincoln, MA 01773*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org <w1vt@arrl.org>] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM *To:* Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY *Subject:* Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
*Archive Error Report*
*Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?*
*Field*
*Data on File*
*Submitted Correction*
Id
140390 <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390>
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-*QST*
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
*ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio*™
225 Main Street
Newington, CT 06111
telephone: 860 594 0294
email: zlau@arrl.org
web: www.arrl.org
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
I find his to be the case most documents converted to PDF, as it counts any cover pages, indices or sub-headings before the first page begins. Confusing and annoying, but it seems to be the norm. Corporate annual reports are especially prone to this. - 73, Dale WA8EFK On 12/16/2019 1:23 PM, Mark J Tharp wrote:
But the page number at the bottom of the PDF is still correct. The digital version counts the cover as a page as well. Never had anyone bring this up to me. A quick glance at the bottom of the page tells you where you are. If this were to change, then the paper version would not match the PDF and that would be confusing.
In my opinion... ?
Mark,HDX
image.png
On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 9:38 AM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>> wrote:
To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
/Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR /
/Six Willarch Road/
/Lincoln, MA 01773/
/781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>/
New England Director
cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:*Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org <mailto:sford@arrl.org>] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM *To:* hopengarten@post.harvard.edu <mailto:hopengarten@post.harvard.edu> *Cc:* Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
*From:* Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>> *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM *To:* Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org <mailto:w1vt@arrl.org>> *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org <mailto:sford@arrl.org>> *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
/Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR /
/Six Willarch Road/
/Lincoln, MA 01773/
/781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>/
New England Director
cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:*Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM *To:* Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY *Subject:* Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
*Archive Error Report*
*Jun 2012-/QST/ - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?*
*Field*
*Data on File*
*Submitted Correction*
Id
140390 <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390>
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-/QST/
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org <mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
*ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio*™
225 Main Street
Newington, CT 06111
telephone: 860 594 0294 <tel:860%20594%200294>
email: zlau@arrl.org <mailto:zlau@arrl.org>
web: www.arrl.org <http://www.arrl.org>
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org <mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
Dale is correct. This is just an idiosyncrasy of a PDF conversion. The page numbers as they appear in the text are correct and do match the TOC as printed. However, the PDF conversion has its own numbering system which includes covers, inserts and title sheets. I deal with this on PDF converted plan sets and contracts all the time. This is trivial and I don’t know an easy way around it. At DOT we aren’t going to waste time or effort on it. 73 David A. Norris, K5UZ Director, Delta Division Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 16, 2019, at 12:48 PM, Dale Williams <dale.wms1@frontier.com> wrote:
I find his to be the case most documents converted to PDF, as it counts any cover pages, indices or sub-headings before the first page begins.
Confusing and annoying, but it seems to be the norm. Corporate annual reports are especially prone to this.
- 73,
Dale WA8EFK
On 12/16/2019 1:23 PM, Mark J Tharp wrote: But the page number at the bottom of the PDF is still correct. The digital version counts the cover as a page as well. Never had anyone bring this up to me. A quick glance at the bottom of the page tells you where you are. If this were to change, then the paper version would not match the PDF and that would be confusing.
In my opinion... ?
Mark,HDX
<image.png>
On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 9:38 AM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> wrote: To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR
Six Willarch Road
Lincoln, MA 01773
781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org
New England Director
<image002.png>
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
From: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM To: hopengarten@post.harvard.edu Cc: Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
From: Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM To: Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR
Six Willarch Road
Lincoln, MA 01773
781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org
New England Director
<image002.png>
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
From: Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM To: Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY Subject: Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
Archive Error Report
Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Field
Data on File
Submitted Correction
Id
140390
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-QST
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio™
225 Main Street
Newington, CT 06111
telephone: 860 594 0294
email: zlau@arrl.org
web: www.arrl.org
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
It’s absolutely possible to make page numbering consistent with the printed document. Pages before numbered pages are numbered with Roman numerals (lowercase) and appendices are A-1 etc. Page numbers are stored as tags in the document metadata. https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/PDF17.html If our digital publishing provider can’t do this simple task for us, maybe we need to look at another one? 73 Ria N2RJ On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 2:55 PM David Norris via arrl-odv < arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> wrote:
Dale is correct.
This is just an idiosyncrasy of a PDF conversion. The page numbers as they appear in the text are correct and do match the TOC as printed. However, the PDF conversion has its own numbering system which includes covers, inserts and title sheets. I deal with this on PDF converted plan sets and contracts all the time. This is trivial and I don’t know an easy way around it. At DOT we aren’t going to waste time or effort on it.
73
David A. Norris, K5UZ Director, Delta Division
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 16, 2019, at 12:48 PM, Dale Williams <dale.wms1@frontier.com> wrote:
I find his to be the case most documents converted to PDF, as it counts any cover pages, indices or sub-headings before the first page begins.
Confusing and annoying, but it seems to be the norm. Corporate annual reports are especially prone to this.
- 73,
Dale WA8EFK
On 12/16/2019 1:23 PM, Mark J Tharp wrote:
But the page number at the bottom of the PDF is still correct. The digital version counts the cover as a page as well. Never had anyone bring this up to me. A quick glance at the bottom of the page tells you where you are. If this were to change, then the paper version would not match the PDF and that would be confusing.
In my opinion... ?
Mark,HDX
<image.png>
On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 9:38 AM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> wrote:
To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+%0D%0A+++++++++++++++Lincoln,%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++++MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*Lincoln, MA 01773 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+%0D%0A+++++++++++++++Lincoln,%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++++MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
<image002.png>
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM *To:* hopengarten@post.harvard.edu *Cc:* Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
*From:* Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM *To:* Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+%0D%0A+++++++++++++++Lincoln,%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++++MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*Lincoln, MA 01773 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+%0D%0A+++++++++++++++Lincoln,%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++++MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
<image002.png>
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org <w1vt@arrl.org>] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM *To:* Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY *Subject:* Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
*Archive Error Report*
*Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?*
*Field*
*Data on File*
*Submitted Correction*
Id
140390 <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390>
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-*QST*
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
*ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio*™
Newington, CT 06111 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/225%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++Main+Street+%0D%0A+++++++++++++++Newington,%0D%0A++++++++++++++++++CT+06111?entry=gmail&source=g>
telephone: 860 594 0294 <860%20594%200294>
email: zlau@arrl.org
web: www.arrl.org
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing listarrl-odv@reflector.arrl.orghttps://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
I find it hard to believe that they can’t simply apply an offset to have the page numbers match. Have we discussed this with them? Computers are automating everything these days. 73 Ria N2RJ On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 12:38 PM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> wrote:
To the Board:
The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints.
I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38.
I thought y’all would like to know.
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*Lincoln, MA 01773 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM *To:* hopengarten@post.harvard.edu *Cc:* Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing.
Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years.
73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY
QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager
*From:* Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org> *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM *To:* Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org> *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org> *Subject:* RE: Archive Error Report June 2012
Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine.
Steve?
*Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR *
*Six Willarch Road <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*Lincoln, MA 01773 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g>*
*781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org <k1vr@arrl.org>*
New England Director
[image: cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564]
Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT
*From:* Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org <w1vt@arrl.org>] *Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM *To:* Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) *Cc:* Ford, Steve, WB8IMY *Subject:* Archive Error Report June 2012
Hi Fred K1VR,
I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine.
The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section.
This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version.
*Archive Error Report*
*Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?*
*Field*
*Data on File*
*Submitted Correction*
Id
140390 <http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390>
4556
Issue
Jun 2012-*QST*
Jun 2012-QST
Title
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic?
Author
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR
Column
Feature
Feature
Keywords
Page
30
30
File
Other
Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30.
Notify
Yes
k1vr@arrl.org
Corrected
No
Created
2019-12-15 16:05:53
Zak Lau W1VT
Senior Lab Engineer
*ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio*™
225 Main Street <https://www.google.com/maps/search/225+Main+Street+Newington,+CT+06111?entry=gmail&source=g>
Newington, CT 06111 <https://www.google.com/maps/search/225+Main+Street+Newington,+CT+06111?entry=gmail&source=g>
telephone: 860 594 0294
email: zlau@arrl.org
web: www.arrl.org
_______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
Dear Ria, Fred, ODV, Steve has asked PageSuite to look into the matter and they hope to have the new numbering in place for March QST. 73, Howard, WB2ITX On 12/16/2019 4:10 PM, rjairam@gmail.com<mailto:rjairam@gmail.com> wrote: I find it hard to believe that they can’t simply apply an offset to have the page numbers match. Have we discussed this with them? Computers are automating everything these days. 73 Ria N2RJ On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 12:38 PM Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org<mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>> wrote: To the Board: The issue is that the digital page and the index listing don’t match. WB8IMY says there have been few complaints. I don’t intend to go to war over this issue, but I feel that officers and members of the Board should know about the issue. It came up when I tried to find the W1ZR article on 43 foot verticals, and I got very confused. The index said the article was on page 30, the digital page was actually page 38. I thought y’all would like to know. Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR Six Willarch Road<https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g> Lincoln, MA 01773<https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g> 781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org<mailto:k1vr@arrl.org> New England Director [cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564] Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT From: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY [mailto:sford@arrl.org<mailto:sford@arrl.org>] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:29 PM To: hopengarten@post.harvard.edu<mailto:hopengarten@post.harvard.edu> Cc: Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012 Fred: While that would be possible, it would require revisions to every page of a digital magazine layout prior to going to press. One of the ways in which the process is cost effective is that it relies on us “touching” the files as little as possible. We send the same files for digital processing that we do for printing. Your notice notwithstanding, complaints about this issue have been virtually non-existent. So, we would have to weigh the required cost and effort against the need. Also, most people use keyword searches in digital editions rather than searching by page numbers, which may be the reason there have been so few complaints over the years. 73 . . . Steve Ford, WB8IMY QST Editor / ARRL Publications Manager From: Fred Hopengarten <k1vr@arrl.org<mailto:k1vr@arrl.org>> Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 12:17 PM To: Lau, Zack, W1VT <w1vt@arrl.org<mailto:w1vt@arrl.org>> Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY <sford@arrl.org<mailto:sford@arrl.org>> Subject: RE: Archive Error Report June 2012 Wow. If I understand it correctly, this means that one cannot rely on the page number when looking up an article in the digital version. Perhaps there should be a note that appears continuously at the top of every page to remind viewers of the shift in page numbers between the printed magazine and the online magazine. Steve? Fred Hopengarten, Esq. K1VR Six Willarch Road<https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g> Lincoln, MA 01773<https://www.google.com/maps/search/Willarch+Road+Lincoln,+MA+01773?entry=gmail&source=g> 781.259.0088, k1vr@arrl.org<mailto:k1vr@arrl.org> New England Director [cid:a4a12f0b-0468-4a39-b953-31b2a3da8564] Serving ME, NH, VT, MA, RI and CT From: Lau, Zack, W1VT [mailto:w1vt@arrl.org] Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 9:48 AM To: Hopengarten, Fred, K1VR, (Dir, NE) Cc: Ford, Steve, WB8IMY Subject: Archive Error Report June 2012 Hi Fred K1VR, I consider page 30 to be the correct page, as is the page number originally printed in the magazine. The digital archive uses page 38, as it calls the first two cover pages page 1 and page 2. There are also six additional pages as part of a special advertising section. This pagination is out of my expertise, I’ll forward this email to Steve Ford who may know the editorial conventions commonly used when you convert a paper magazine to a digital version. Archive Error Report Jun 2012-QST - The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? Field Data on File Submitted Correction Id 140390<http://p1k.arrl.org/pubs_archive/140390> 4556 Issue Jun 2012-QST Jun 2012-QST Title The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? The 43 Foot Vertical Monopole -- What's the Magic? Author Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR Joel R. Hallas, W1ZR Column Feature Feature Keywords Page 30 30 File Other Actually, the article starts on page 38, not page 30. Notify Yes Email k1vr@arrl.org<mailto:k1vr@arrl.org> Corrected No Created 2019-12-15 16:05:53 Zak Lau W1VT Senior Lab Engineer ARRL, the National Association for Amateur Radio™ 225 Main Street<https://www.google.com/maps/search/225+Main+Street+Newington,+CT+06111?entry=gmail&source=g> Newington, CT 06111<https://www.google.com/maps/search/225+Main+Street+Newington,+CT+06111?entry=gmail&source=g> telephone: 860 594 0294<tel:860%20594%200294> email: zlau@arrl.org<mailto:zlau@arrl.org> web: www.arrl.org<http://www.arrl.org> _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org<mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv -- Howard E. Michel, WB2ITX Chief Executive Officer ARRL, The National Association for Amateur Radio® 225 Main Street, Newington, CT 06111-1494 USA Telephone: +1 860-594-0404 email: hmichel@arrl.org<mailto:hmichel@arrl.org>
participants (7)
-
Dale Williams -
David Norris -
Fred Hopengarten -
G Widin -
Mark J Tharp -
Michel, Howard, WB2ITX (CEO) -
rjairam＠gmail.com