To all, I just reviewed Robert’s Rules of Order 11th edition regarding changes of Bylaws, pp 592-599. They indicate that: “Special requirements for this motion’s adoption should be specified in the bylaws, and they should always include at least notice and a two-thirds vote, which (with a vote of the entire membership as an allowable alternative) are the requirements for its adoption if such specification in the bylaws is neglected.” They make no specific reference to roll-call votes; that apparently is left up to the organization to decide. We already specify notice and vote requirements for changes to our Bylaws within Article #10. I do not see a reference to roll-call votes within our Articles or Bylaws for modification of either document. If roll-call votes are desired by the board, the requirement must be specified in the Articles of Association or Bylaws. It appears our change should be in Article #10. If desired, this will need to be an Articles change at the next board meeting. Personally, I see no need for this. If the body desires to pass a Bylaw, the numbers pass by the ¾ or 2/3 requirement, and there is no contest to the vote, it should be considered adopted. From the end of the July board meeting on, a request for a roll-call vote by 5 directors would satisfy the need for a roll-call vote should the body desire. As an interesting aside, once a Bylaw is favorably passed, according to RRO it goes into effect immediately unless a specific time is set within the motion (i.e. this motion goes into effect at the close of this board meeting). We have always stated that all business/motions go into effect at the conclusion of the board meeting. Many things are passed down as “this is the way we have always done this”, but simple clarifications in our bylaws/articles will assist us and future generations of the board. ‘73 de Jim N2ZZ Director – Roanoke Division Representing ARRL members in North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia and West Virginia ARRL – the national association for Amateur Radio Facebook Page: ARRL Roanoke Division Website: www.arrl-roanoke.org<http://www.arrl-roanoke.org/> [Text, logo Description automatically generated] From: arrl-odv <arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org> On Behalf Of Art Zygielbaum Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2023 5:29 PM To: k5ur@aol.com; Middleton, Diane, W2DLM (CFO) <dmiddleton@arrl.org>; Tharp, Mark, KB7HDX (VD, NW) <kb7hdx@gmail.com>; Martin, Sabrina <smartin@arrl.org> Cc: arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org Subject: [arrl-odv:35061] Re: Draft Board Minutes Rick, I think it is actually a good practice to do roll call votes for changes to the Articles of Association or ByLaws. The reason is to have documented assurance that the count is accurate for these important activities. It might make sense if we explicitly add this to the ByLaws and/or Articles during our next board meeting. The Articles might be more appropriate since that's where procedures to amend both are contained. 73, Art -- Arthur I. Zygielbaum, K0AIZ ARRL Midwest Division Director Member, Executive Committee Member, Programs and Services Committee Member, ARRL Foundation Board ARRL - The National Association for Amateur Radio® On 8/3/2023 2:04 PM, k5ur@aol.com<mailto:k5ur@aol.com> wrote: Art, I know it has been a long-standing practice. I looked back in old minutes 20 years ago and we were doing roll call votes back then for Articles and Bylaw changes, which goes back to Jim Haynie days, four Presidents ago, and it may go back further than that. I did not check. In the back of my mind, I seem to recall some discussion, way back when (I can almost hear Sumner saying this... really, but I've slept since then), that we needed to assure the vote was accurate, given the 2/3 or 3/4 vote requirement, so that may be the basis for having a roll call vote, but I did have time right now to go through the Article, Bylaws, and Standing Orders looking for a specific provision. If we want to change our practice, that's fine with me. Rick - K5UR On Thursday, August 3, 2023 at 12:57:12 PM CDT, Art Zygielbaum <k0aiz@arrl.org><mailto:k0aiz@arrl.org> wrote: Is this Robert's Rules? I can't find a reference in any of our documents. But I respectfully accept your direction on this. Art -- Arthur I. Zygielbaum, K0AIZ ARRL Midwest Division Director Member, Executive Committee Member, Programs and Services Committee Member, ARRL Foundation Board ARRL - The National Association for Amateur Radio® On 8/3/2023 12:00 PM, Middleton, Diane, W2DLM (CFO) wrote: Mark, Article and By-Law changes require a roll call vote. Diane From: arrl-odv <arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org><mailto:arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org> On Behalf Of Mark J Tharp Sent: Thursday, August 3, 2023 12:52 PM To: Martin, Sabrina <smartin@arrl.org><mailto:smartin@arrl.org> Cc: arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org<mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> Subject: [arrl-odv:35048] Re: Draft Board Minutes Are roll call votes "required" for a by-law change? I thought they were only used when requested. ? Mark, HDX On Thu, Aug 3, 2023 at 9:16 AM Martin, Sabrina <smartin@arrl.org<mailto:smartin@arrl.org>> wrote: Good afternoon, Attached are the draft board minutes for your review. Thank you. Sabrina Martin Executive Assistant ARRL The National Association for Amateur Radio® 225 Main Street Newington, CT 06111 (860)594-0242 [cid:j6lDAQYUUL6tAqzjfhkH] _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org<mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org<mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv _______________________________________________ arrl-odv mailing list arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org<mailto:arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> https://reflector.arrl.org/mailman/listinfo/arrl-odv
