Good point, Mickey. It will be good to talk this through. I do support Mike's argument but will stand with whatever he decides as the approach after the discussion. Thanks, Art -- Arthur I. Zygielbaum, K0AIZ ARRL Midwest Division Director Member, Executive Committee Member, Programs and Services Committee Member, ARRL Foundation Board ARRL - The National Association for Amateur Radio® On 2/27/2023 2:06 PM, Baker, Mickey, N4MB (Dir, SE) wrote:
Amen.
Mike, you did a great job with your interactions with the field day study and rule changes. It was based on fairly good science.
What Art suggests is what marketing folks call an "after the fact" survey. The problem is folks who get upset and walk. You lose a large percentage of potential faithful participants who just quietly don’t participate. You won't be counting those votes!
I've found that most of the membership doesn't complain, but
Finally, allow my to post the text from the VP and FD Chairman from the North Fulton ARC.
The NFARC is one of the SE Division's largest clubs with 500+ members and is the largest club in the Atlanta area.
From KO4VW...
Hi Mickey,
It was a pleasure to have you at the North Fulton Amateur Radio League Field day last year and hopefully you can make it again. I'm very disappointed by what I'm hearing about CW being demoted. One of the main reasons people like myself work so hard to get into and become proficient at CW is Field Day. That was certainly the case for me, and is for the students I have right now. This is part of what made a big ARRL supporter. Many of us are just disgusted with this and many CW operators are talking about not participating in protest. CW is a skill that isn't easy to learn and really can't be done casually. There should be some reward for that, but now it seems ARRL doesn't appreciate all the hard work put in by its members. Also, as much Field Day planning starts as soon as the last one is over the timing is really poor. I hope this can be changed.
Steve Randall KO4VW Vice President, NFARL Hi Mickey, It was a pleasure to have you at the North Fulton Amateur Radio League Field day last year and hopefully you can make it again. I'm very disappointed by what I'm hearing about CW being demoted. One of the main reasons people like myself work so hard to get into and become proficient at CW is Field Day. That was certainly the case for me, and is for the students I have right now. This is part of what made a big ARRL supporter. Many of us are just disgusted with this and many CW operators are talking about not participating in protest. CW is a skill that isn't easy to learn and really can't be done casually. There should be some reward for that, but now it seems ARRL doesn't appreciate all the hard work put in by its members. Also, as much Field Day planning starts as soon as the last one is over the timing is really poor. I hope this can be changed.
Steve Randall KO4VW Vice President, NFARL
------------------------------------------------------------------------ *From:* arrl-odv <arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org> on behalf of Bob Famiglio, K3RF via arrl-odv <arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> *Sent:* Monday, February 27, 2023 2:32 PM *To:* Ritz, Mike, W7VO, (Dir, NW) <w7vo@comcast.net>; arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org <arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org> *Subject:* [arrl-odv:34622] Re: Field Day Point Value Changes
*/“That said, the CW guys are all crying foul loudly, and we will listen to them. I plan on holding a special PSC meeting to discuss the change, and may propose that we change it back to what it was before, then have ARRL Staff set up a survey of ALL ARRL members, and get everybody's input on this, not just hearing from the loud and proud CW guys."/*
*//*
Whether it gets changed or not, *Mike, this is the definition of responsiveness* and the “I hear you” that members sometimes complain about. Hey, the rational I would argue for encouraging CW during field day is emergency operations, but reasonable minds can differ, especially among new hams.
Mike is right that after the Navy and coast guard dropped it, we gave up. OK. But NTS proved CW’s value in real life, unexpectedly, back during the Cascadia Rising FEMA drill they participated in not too long ago. They planned to use their established digital assets to move 150 injected text group messages automatically, RF only as specified by FEMA, from west coast to the Fema Region 3 headquarters on east coast. Conditions were so bad, it did not work and all those messages were passed (relayed once) on 10.1 MHz CW. I listened to it. A wonder to behold and unexpected. Damn they were good.
NTS’s (at least the old NTS) well written, bound and illustrated report sent to FEMA and to HQ is a good read. If you never saw it I can send you a PDF copy. I understand the arguments against CW otherwise, but the members mostly do not so far. I see a trend but it is only the second day I have been receiving grief so we will see. This is the reason many will hang their hat on for field day rules. Not a contest, but a demonstration.
*Bob Famiglio, K3RF*
*Director - ARRL Atlantic Division*
*610-359-7300*
/Serving NNY, WNY, WPA, EPA, SNJ, DE and MD/DC sections/
www.QRZ.com/db/K3RF <http://www.qrz.com/db/K3RF>
*From:* arrl-odv <arrl-odv-bounces@reflector.arrl.org> *On Behalf Of *Michael Ritz *Sent:* Monday, February 27, 2023 1:55 PM *To:* arrl-odv@reflector.arrl.org *Subject:* [arrl-odv:34618] Field Day Point Value Changes
I'm sure many have seen the rants from the guys on MyARRLVoice, and have received letters from the CW Ops guys about the recent PSC recommendation to level the score playing field for all modes in FD. Below is my comment to one such complaint, and provides some background on the issue.
These are my opinions, and do not necessarily reflect the opinions of ARRL staff or the the PSC.
"First of all, know that I'm pretty much ambivalent in this, and don't really have a dog in the fight. I operate SSB, CW and RTTY pretty much equally, but am not on FT-8 at all. I'm too busy tending to e-mails and my other Board work to even get on the air except the big contest weekends! I've received a few e-mails that are saying what the PSC are doing here is OK and maybe even needed action, and a few that are espousing that equalizing mode scores in ARRL FD is going to destroy amateur radio as we know it.
This question was hotly debated in the PSC meeting over the last few months. We received a lot of complaints last year about the intrusion of FT-8 and FT-4 into Field Day, to the detriment of the other modes, just as is happening with just about the entire rest of amateur radio. That is borne out somewhat with in the attached graph. You will also notice in the graph that CW contacts in FD now outnumber SSB contacts. Why is that? It's probably because CW has had a recent resurgence because of groups like CW ops, and that's a good thing.
Has the elimination of CW as a license requirement in 2004 killed off CW as an amateur mode and destroyed amateur radio, as predicted? No. Again, refer to the graph. Will CW die in FD because the points are now the same for all modes? I don't know, but I would bet against it.
Now a question: Is the main reason new hams are learning CW is that they know that CW operators are able to get twice the points of the phone guys for the same number of Qs in FD? FD is technically not a contest, and in fact, no logs are even submitted. I don't think that's the reason at all. It's because they want to learn something new, and find they enjoy it.
The hardcore CW guys love CW, and for the most part, despise phone. I know quite a few elite contesting hams that refuse to even own microphone, and I'm sure you know some too. It's somewhat an elitist attitude, and I'm sure that's one of the reasons the CW guys want their point advantage. They believe they are better than everybody else because they "know code", and I don't think they would deny that thought. "I learned CW, so I'm smarter than you"! The opening remark about the "ARRL dumbing down amateur radio" by leveling the FD playing field on the recent MyARRLVoice Facebook topic on the subject pretty much says it all.
One of the arguments I've seen also is that FD is supposed to be an Emcomm event, and "when all else fails, CW gets through in an emergency." That said, the newer digital modes are actually better than CW for this, and there is no CW mode that I know of used within Winlink, something very often used in EmComm activity.
We, (the PSC),thought of reducing the points for digital to match SSB as an incentive to get off FT-8, leaving CW alone at the top, but that would end up reducing points for those attempting to use traditional digital modes, such as RTTY, or the other non-FT-x modes in FD. So, we decided that maybe just letting market forces take over and equalize the points between all three modes was the best strategy. People will use then mode they are most comfortable with, and everybody has fun. No advantage for anybody.
OK, now the question: Why should CW Qs have a 2:1 point advantage over other modes in FD? Is it because one can make more Qs per hour with phone over CW? No, that's not the case. If one researches the CQWW contest rates over the last few years, one will see that they are pretty much equal now, with the edge now to CW ops.
I haven't heard a real and valid reason yet provided by the CW guys for the point advantage not being eliminated in FD, other than what I've heard above, and the fact that the incentive "has been in place since 1974, so why change it"?
That said, the CW guys are all crying foul loudly, and we will listen to them. I plan on holding a special PSC meeting to discuss the change, and may propose that we change it back to what it was before, then have ARRL Staff set up a survey of ALL ARRL members, and get everybody's input on this, not just hearing from the loud and proud CW guys."
I hope this helps the discussion. I don't appreciate the bullying attitude being taken by some on social media, and the PSC is just trying to make sure that FD stays a "fun factor" operating event/contest for all. Field Day is what you want to make it.
Thanks for listening.
73;
Mike
W7VO
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